Golf course owner, Charlie Gibson, continues to approach individual homeowners and our Board to subsidize the golf course for 10 years to keep it operational. In one-on-one discussions Mr. Gibson asserts he will “not open his books” to the HOA for audit, appraisal or valuation. This lack of financial transparency poses a dilemma for both individual homeowners and the HOA. Without conducting financial due diligence, how can we make an informed decision whether this subsidy is a good investment for our community or simply lining the pockets of the golf course owners? Without financial information (salaries, maintenance, utilities, etc.), audited or reviewed by a licensed third party, proper stewardship of our money cannot be assured.
If you are interested in understanding more about golf course economics and what type of information we’d require to make a decision, please go to golfappraisers.org. If you are interested in the salaries (expenses) paid to golf course managers, staff and maintenance personnel go to average golf course salary or glassdoor.com-average golf course salaries
After I received the newsletter, I have been eagerly waiting for a post like this. It is only common sense 101 – everything that is stated here. You need some real estate experts, auditors, appraisers, etc. to review this whole scenario in conjunction with the board and experts on HOA’s. This thing has to be studied from many different angles and then you have to compare how each angle looks when compared with other golf courses, other communities, other similar situations. The lack of transparency is a big red flag. Other negative items mentioned in the news letter are big red flags. The fact that the owner is suddenly selling his house, moving far away to a beautiful upscale community, commuting to Morgan Creek all while broke and making no money, but everything is a secret and he offers no rebuttals….it is insulting to the community’s intelligence. Oh, and it makes him look like a scammer. What other conclusion is there? I bet you could piece together something on the worth of the golf course and the profit / loss and balance sheet just by plugging in average numbers and counting the cars in the parking lot and then compare it to other similar courses / scenarios…..you could come up with a ball park. Also, I hear no talk of strategy. If the golf course is doing so bad, why? What has been done? What has not been done? Why? Way too many unanswered questions…..People who don’t like questions have something to hide.
I would be very surprised if any homeowners board could approve a subsidy like this absent full disclosure of the golf course financials. Seems that any approval absent full disclosure would violate their fiduciary duties to the homeowners.
I personally believe that we may need to study in detail the recent case of Whitney’s Golf Course in Rocklin apparently an exact replica of our current case. In my opinion any subsidy, or home development ought to be out of the question. I also wonder if Charlie Gibson’s proposals are perfectly legal.
I say let him close the course. Thanks for all your efforts , but it’s a waste of time at this point.
No disclosure, no deal! Yes, we want to maintain our property values, but this sounds like blackmail with no end in sight.
If Charlie will not disclose any financials, there is no way we can approve a subsidy. With that being said, we shouldn’t give him a subsidy without something in return. I’m guessing the cost of maintaining the course is relatively a fixed cost. Whether there are 10 players per day, or 200. If there is more foot traffic, maybe they have to do some additional maintenance, but guessing not much difference in cost. If he wants a subsidy, why don’t we propose asking for something in return. A couple of ideas come to mind.
Offer some type of social or golf membership in exchange.
Offer social events or dinner events (give vouchers in the amounts of the HOA subsidy.
If they want free funds and no strings attached, NO THANKS! We already see how the government wastes tax dollars. Why should he be given a blank check?
Sounds like an American Greed story in the making.
THANK YOU to the person that started this Blog. Appreciate the efforts. I mirror David Aria’s comments. Charlie just put MANY millions of dollars in the bank after settling with the city of Rocklin and another million or so after selling the lend next to the pool. He has already invested to expand the clubhouse and I seriously doubt that if the course was in trouble, that he would have spend that money. If he is in trouble, he should sell the course. This is just a money grab using the threat of closing the golf course. This situation is not the same as Sunset Whitney. Bad behavior should not be rewarded.
I recommend people contact the media. SacBee has run stories on Charile before regarding the Rocklin Golf Course. SacBee:http://www.sacbee.com/customer-service/contact-us/
KCRA 3: (916) 444-7316 | newstips@kcra.com
Fox40: http://fox40.com/contact/fox40-contact-information/
CBS: http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/station/cbs13-cw31/
ABC10: https://www.abc10.com/contact-us
It sounds like generally speaking everyone is on the same page as far as being skeptical, asking for financials & disclosures and wanting something in return…..I do not see many homeowners wanting to throw around no-strings, no questions-asked money……which is all very reasonable.
I don’t believe Charlie has broken any laws or anything that would warrant the involvement of the State Attorney General (at this point). As for the lawsuit, what would be the grounds? I’m certainly not defending Charlie and his practices but he owns the golf course privately and in my reading hasn’t committed any crimes (yet). He is entitled to ask homeowners for subsidies to keep the course open (we don’t have to agree), he is entitled to sell the golf course to whomever he wants; he’s entitled to walk away and let the land go to weeds. I don’t like any of those options but they are the rights as owner of the business an the property.
Agree, no Attorney General needed and this is not a law suit matter, though I understand the sentiment.
Not yet, but if he is asking for subsidiary stating the golf course is not profitable and will close without homeowners money and turns out to be a lie, than that is fraud and money was given under a false context. That is grounds for a lawsuit. This is California, you can sue anyone for anything these days. If he has also has done this before than the media should be contacted for public awareness in the Sacramento community. If he proceeds in asking without opening up his books, than I definitely think the media needs to be notified and while it might not be a criminal act yet, it’s a moral one that affects people buying in golf communities.
Very good points! If he decides to walk away and let the course go, do you think he can block others from buying it?? Wonder if his ownership would allow him to just let it grow weeds? It would be nice if we could block him from doing that, and force him to sell. I wonder if he had to sign any type of an agreement with the city or community. It seems there should be some type of protection for the community.
I’m wondering if the city would have to approve new zoning for him to build on it. It would very hurtful to those that purchased property with views of the golf course.
It would be honorable for him to entertain selling it before he’d let it go to the weeds!!
@Dustin – Unfortunately, there is no mechanism that would force the owners to sell the golf course. The golf course is privately owned by Morgan Creek LLC (co-owned by Charlie Gibson & a silent partner). There are no agreements with the county that require it to remain operational (we are not under city of Roseville jurisdiction).
Yes, Placer County would have to approve any redevelopment efforts. This group plans on heavily lobbing the county against any redevelopment proposals.
Agree that it would be honorable for the owners to sell instead of abandoning it but unfortunately that is entirely the owners’ decision to make.
In Rocklin at Sunset Whitely county denied his rezoning requests. Placer county has to do the same as long we MC OWNERS meet the Placer County Supervisors in advance, let them known about this situation and alert them. If he chooses to shut down the golf course he will be racking more expenses…..grass will go crazy and it will be fire hazard and county will be forcing him to maintain the safety and keep the land in check. He has choice to sell of shut it down. Shut downing will hurt him more, by selling it he will walk away with $3 -$4 million profit. Let’s see if he plays stupid or smart.
So if Charlie is so broke that he needs homeowner assistance, how can he afford all the new golf carts that rolled in today. Probably 30 to 40 brand new carts!
I sure would like a new Bentley can you home owners spare $20 for my new car fund?
Agreed…..it’s a scam…